- Consumers because they've already surpassed through this evolution. So do you see a convergence in terms of some patterns between western markets and Asian markets? - For sure yes, but as said earlier, I think these different motivations are shown at different stages of luxury goods consumption to individual levels. So, because of the fact that those westernerns, like Europeans and Americans, who were exposed to luxury goods much earlier than Asian consumers, I think relatively speaking they are more at the later stage of the evolution, that they purchase products for their inner satisfaction. But really being in this regional work level, it's also amazing to see how fast this gaps are being closed - I see. - between western and Asian markets. Actually in the past, it's very interesting because in the past, even when I was working for Chanel about 4 years ago, one of the recipies to succeed in China as a luxury brand is really to put your logos everywhere in a very prominent manner with a very big exposure. So Chanel for instance, a few years back they renovated one of their boutiques in Hong Kong Canton Road, Hong Kong, where the majority of consumers are coming from mainland China. So actually they put a humongous CC logo outside of the façade and also consecutive big CC logos at the entrances of their boutiques which cannot be found in any place in Europe for instance, that they place their logos in a much more subtle way. However, the trend really confirms these days, even Chinese consumers, they are looking for more and more niche brand and smaller name brands because they want to feel exclusive. So I think as a confirmation, for instance, last year, actually Louis Vuitton, the demand from Chinese consumers in China and also travelling Chinese, the demand of a brand like Louis Vuitton was in decline dramatically because Louis Vuitton was everywhere and it became quite a commonplace. So I can really confirm that this trend has been kind of merged and then the gap has been closed. - Right. So if I can summarize what you've said I think that your suggestion is that Asians have not only caught up, they've actually surpassed in many ways, some consumers, the level of sofistication and sort of the demand for exclusivity compared to maybe some western fashions. - For sure, that's why I think now brands have to be very cautious when they enter really the Asian market. It's no longer that Asians will be crazy about luxury goods as far as there's a big logo. - Right. Okay. Let's talk about a very intersting segment in Asia and of course women are a key target market for luxury products and brands. And we have the so-called "career-minded women" called the "Gold Misses" in Korea. - Right. Sounds familiar, yes - And you have them in other countries, in Japan they are called "Arafo"... - Right, in China also. - And so, why are they so important in the marketing of lux brands? - I think it's very true that this group of consumers are becoming so important. Probably not only for the luxury sector, but others. - Right. - But more importantly for luxury. Because the status of the marriage rate has been in decline among these women in Asian markets, including Japan, Korea, Singapore and Hong Kong, while the number of women who have a higher education is actually growing significantly in the past decades. As a consequence, I think, there are more and more women who have higher income than ever, but single woman, who have this purchasing power. As you rightly spotted, they are called "Gold Miss", and "Gold Miss" are women in their 30's or older who have never been married and also who have their own careers and are earning higher salaries than average. And I think these people are getting kind of like, you know, lonely, because they are not planning to get married soon, it's because the new role of these women in Asian society. I think to a certain extent it kind of implies certain conflict for Asian families. And I don't want to go into these details because we will need maybe 3 to 4 more hours to discuss this. But, as a matter of fact, this people, this group of women, they are willing to invest in themselves they are very interested at developing themselves. So they go to cooking classes after work, they learn several languages, and, really the motivation of purchasing luxury it really matches perfectly because they are looking forward to having a sense of self achievement and they are really seeking for quality. That's why it's inevitable that these people became really the core target group of those luxury brands. - So these are all symbols of their self-achievement... - Independence. - And their individualism. - Very much, yes. - Okay. We talked a lot about women as being targets, but what about men? Are they sometimes a target of luxury products and brands? - So men, actually, when we talk about men in luxury sectors, relatively speaking they are still small compared to women consumers but actually the growth rate of those people, I mean the men sector, is growing faster than women. And most of men actually are buying more and more fashion clothes and also shoes and accessory and bags, for instance. - Right. And grooming products... - Very much. - Fragances... And it has been also shown that such a dramatic increase on those men's categories, like, for instance, in Japan. It has been quite a long history that there are department stores really specific in targeting only men, it's quite common. But in the rest of countries all this growth is driven by emerging markets like China, for instance. And I think also it's a little bit similar to the phenomenon of this "Gold Miss" that there are also more and more men who kind of delay their marriage, because they want to enjoy their lives. - These are the so-called metrosexual men and the "Gold Misters" maybe? - Maybe [LAUGHTER] I don't know what they are called but these are the group... I think this is quite obvious and people are becoming more individualistic and they don't want to get a burden of supporting families, they just want to enjoy their life. - Okay. Sticking on the subject of brands, we hear a lot about cult brands in fashion. So why do consumers demand or seek out cult brands? - I think a cult brand is a brand or service really having this close to fanatic fan base. - Okay. - Who really are true believers in their brand. - Okay. - And this essence of cult, I think it's quite important in luxury brands, because, I think it's because of two reasons. The first reason is because, at the end of the day, luxury goods are not a necessity. - Right, right - Right? So... - Even though we think they are. - A lot of women think, of course. But, it's more for indulgence. So in theory, we don't have to buy luxury goods, right? And then the second reason is because of this fearce competition, I think the power has been slowly but surely shifted to the hands of consumers compared to brands, because there are so many brands to chose from, and also there are quite a lot of information that consumers can access 24/7 through hundreds of TV cable channels and millions of websites and mobile applications. So luckily, even if brands can reach certain target consumers, it does not mean that they will listen to you. So in this competitive environment and very dynamic luxury world, to have a strong voice, I think brands should engage consumers, not only with data, but also with the human needs, for instance. With a story-telling which reasons the brand vision into their lifestyle, for instance. So I think that's why it's becoming more important, And I give you an example of this brand. It's not really a luxury brand but in this industry it's considered as a luxury because it's more expensive than the competitors. It's called LuLulemon, do you know the brand? - Yeah, yeah. - So it's a brand selling more or less sportswear right? But their clothes are meant for healthy lifestyle activities, mainly for yoga. So, how they market their brand is not through big advertisement money but they market their brand through community-based activities. - Including social media? - Including definetely social media. And revolving around their retail outlets, for instance. So they throw a lot of local events really to gather this community, which are very relevant for their motto. Because their events mainly are like yoga classes, and like to talk about this healthy lifestyle. So it has been seen that Lululemon is showing such a tremendous growth in the past years and now they are competing with Nike for instance in certain sectors, Because of this fan base, who has been sharing their vision and their interests all together, so it has been growing and growing dramatically. - That's a fascinating, I think, analysis, So you see cult brands as being, in a way, sort of a sign of consumer empowerment? - Right, for sure. Yes - Last question. The definition of luxury marketing can be very broad, and nowadays, we have a lot of IT products even entering into the lux market, such as with wearable technology. So, is this a general trend that you see happening for many brands? - Actually, that was a very spot on question because in Swarovski, we just launched it, the wearable jewelry in January this year in the States. And also it's gonna be launched in March in China and Hong Kong as a test. Definitely, yes. Actually, we have collaborated with an activity tracker company called Misfits, based in California and it's almost one of the first tries to incorporate the tracking activities into jewelries. But then I also see this trend actually getting bigger and bigger. Because some of the high-end luxury watch brands, they also actually introduce some of the watches, which can track all these activities, including sleeping and exercise. So definitely, it's growing a trend. - And so, this is not only true for Swarovski, but other lux brands, too? - Yes, that I see more and more. - Okay, okay. Thank you very much. This has been very insightful. - Thanks a lot for invitation. Thank you. - Thank you. - Thank you so much.
